Claiming to Be Wise...

It seems that the first argument made here last fall by Godlessons, in which he argued that there is a contradiction between God’s omniscience (at least if that means knowing the future perfectly) and his omnipotence, is one put forward by Richard Dawkins in The God Delusion. All this time I thought it was just a very silly argument made up by some unthinking dude on the internet when it turns out instead that it’s “a very weak challenge coming from a superior intellect,” to quote Greg Koukl.

Comments

[Godlessons]

I'm flattered you remember our conversation. :)

I actually never have read The God Delusion and never had a desire to. I don't find his arguments particularly insightful, and I certainly don't need help understanding why religion makes no sense.

I never said the argument originated with me, although I don't remember reading it or hearing it anywhere prior to contemplating it. As far as I can tell, I first thought of it because of a strange answer I was given to a simple question about 10 years ago. I asked a man how he ended up in this small California town from whatever state he started in. He asked me why I thought he had a choice in the matter. He said the universe had decided that he would be in California long before he was ever born. That's about the extent of our conversation, but the odd nature of his answer made me start thinking about determinism, although I had never heard of it before. My mind went from there to God, who I still believed in at the time, and I wondered how an omniscient being could be surprised about what his creation did if everything had a reason and he knew all of them.

Anyway, do you have a link to what you are talking about? When I put that quote in google, the only link that comes up is your page. I see nothing by Koukl. You don't say how it's weak or anything, so I am curious why you even made a post about it.

[rebecca]

The link is there in the post (put forward by Richard Dawkins). The Koukl quote is transcribed from the video.

How does it feel to come up with the same argument as "a superior intellect"? :)

I posted on this because I thought the video was interesting and the argument reminded me of the one you made. Not said in exactly the same way, but at the core I think it's pretty much the same argument. Of course I remember it. How can I think things through enough to make responses to it and not remember it?

Oh! And God isn't surprised by what his creation does because, as you say, everything has a reason and he knows them all.